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Your father was a professor at Notre Dame and was a great supporter of Antonio Gramsci. You can always correct me if I'm wrong, but that's what I read on the internet. And Gramsci is an interesting man, right? For the most part, he was probably pro-communist, had certain leanings, Marxist, whatever you want to call it. Some would even say that he was more influential than Marx because he was able to implement it into systems. And when you study this person, you think, "Okay, all this hegemony, you know what's next? You know, first get the kids involved, let's get the teachers on our side, take the kids and then send them into different industries, and keep repeating that until eventually there are enough people who want to be
communists," and all that. What is part of your admiration for your father, Antonio Gramsci, because you spoke well of your father, that he had a great influence on your life? What did you argue with your father about and say: "Dad, I disagree with the following philosophical views of Antonio Gramsci?" Oh, we argued all the time. We usually. I think that's how I learned to debate. It was obvious, I love my father. My father and I argued, usually after dinner. We had dinner. Sometimes he did, but usually my mother cooked. But he and I were
responsible for washing the dishes. And we started washing the dishes. I brought the dishes. I was loading the dishwasher. He washed pots and pans. And we started arguing about something. And usually, not always, but usually he was a little more left-wing in his political views than I was, and we kind of discussed that. He was a man who was quite skeptical of communist governments. He was extremely skeptical about Cuba, the USSR. But he was a Gramsci scholar. And so, as you said, Antonio Gramsci was a left-wing Italian thinker. He did most of his work in prison. Mussolini, the fascist dictator, imprisoned him. And he spent most of his life writing in these little notebooks in prison, which were later smuggled out. And what
he wrote turned out to be quite important. Father translated them all. Yes, he translated many of those notebooks Everywhere, they spread everywhere. And the most interesting thing is that most of the people in America now who have put Gramsci's ideas into practice are on the right wing. So, look at Breitbart, for example. Breitbart was known for paying a lot of attention to Gramsci. But it's not just in the US. In Hungary, Viktor Orban actually wrote his dissertation on Gramsci. And in Italy, there is now a minister in the Meloni government who wrote an entire book about Gramsci. So, although Gramsci was a leftist, most of the people who have used his ideas in recent times have been right-wing.
And as a leftist, I think my father would probably be turning in his grave if he knew that it was Trumpism that got ahead of the left on some of these insights. For example, one of the sayings attributed to Breitbart is: politics is a derivative of culture. Steve Bannon says it too. I forget which one of them said it first. But this is something that Gramsci talked about a lot, this idea of hegemony, that. I think the strategy is right, but the goal was different. Of course, Gramsci wanted a completely different outcome than the others. Gramsci gave a marketing strategy, but his intention was to ultimately build a world different from the one that
conservatives build. Do you agree with this? Probably. I mean, honestly, I'm not as expert on all his political theory as my father is. I only know that the most pressing issue in our time seems to be the issue of strategy. And you know, my side likes to think of itself as more intellectual, but I think sometimes the right has beaten us. Look at. yeah, look at things like the Heritage Foundation. And the truth is, we don't have anything like the Cato Institute, this whole ecosystem of think tanks. Yes. I think they created them 30, 40, 50 years ago because they felt they needed a counterbalance to the universities. They believed they were doing the same thing for the left
as the left did. I think over the years, universities have actually become less associated with the political left. And the right and these think tanks have become very.I mean, look at things like Project 2025. Remember, we had a whole fight over Project 2025. Trump assured everyone that he had nothing to do with it and had no idea what it was. Mhm. But now. What is the most important thing? I don't even remember what was most important. a thousand pages of material, and most of it what was the most terrifying thing then? you know, like eliminating the Ministry of Education, things they're actually doing now. So, the Heritage Foundation boasts that most of the points of the "Project 2025" have become a reality
. And it was an extremely unpopular set of ideas. It was politically toxic, so we tried to use it as part of the campaign strategy. Remember, we kept big copies of all of this, of course. Yes. Um, I think it even worked a little bit, because of course I didn't win, but it worked in the sense that I mean, did Trump distance himself? This is also a form of result. So he Yes, yes. Then he appointed the head of this project, Russ Voth, as the head, right? So, he was a big supporter of "Project 20." So you I had the president on the air. What was that guy's name? Kevin Roberts, I think.
President of Heritage, yes. Er, Heritage. Oh, you're talking about, yes, the president of Heritage, Jesse. Yes, but, yes, you're right. Russ Voth, who was involved in all of this, was appointed by President Trump as head of the Office of Management and Budget. Yes? So obviously I don't think the president was telling the truth when he distanced himself from this. But, in any case, I want to say that this level of strategic thinking was lacking in my party. So when I think about the 30, 40, 50-year project of abolishing the right to choose in America, it was the result of really patient and organized work. I think, I think my side was a little more focused on the present moment. And less attentive to the long-term strategy of how to,
you know, build a country that reflects the values that guide us, which, again, I would say, are values that most Americans share. Uh, so the majority of Americans increasingly support us on many of these important issues, like health care, taxes, wages , political reform. Um, so part of what I'm trying to bring to my side, my party, is the ability, frankly, to learn from the right and be a little more strategic, a little more thoughtful, even a little more intellectual. This is strange to hear from someone with center-left views. Intellectual? But to be as intellectual as the right. But even because I think the right doesn't get enough recognition for, um, strategic recognition.
I don't find it intellectual in my understanding. Because when I mean the connection between your basic principles, your big ideas. You are not talking about education or diplomas. You say about No, no. Yes, yes. No, I'm just saying that you need to have a connection between your core principles, your fundamental philosophical beliefs, and what you do every day in your campaigns and your political ideas. And I actually think that sometimes the right pays more attention to this than we do. Interesting. How much of this do you think is due to a man of a new era, like the late Charlie Kirk? Mhm. Do you think there were others who led this before him?
How much of a role do you think this was, since he is no longer with us? He, in my opinion, was the most dangerous person for the right and the left Mhm. Because for a long time, the left had the youth. Mhm. I mean Antonio Gramsci's philosophy: hey, get them involved in school, get them involved as early as possible. And then you know what happens, like, "Yeah, I don't have to go to school." Oh, no, no, we can't let this happen. Children must go to school. Mhm. What happens if we lose children who go to school? And then we saw that girls were getting diplomas, bachelor's degrees, women, more than men.
Mhm. So they play a role, but do you attribute that to someone like Charlie Kirk? Was he one of those who had influence? Um, I think this is probably coming from someone higher up than him. Of course. But I really think he did something, even though I had huge disagreements with him. Um, but he did something really important, which was going out on campuses and having these debates. Mhm. And I think it's more difficult now, especially because young people are living more and more online. Isn't that right? So you're
in this online world where most of what you see is someone you already agree with, and they look great. Or when you see someone you disagree with, they act like fools. I guess your feed, as someone with more conservative views, if people from my party show up there, usually shows our biggest mistakes, our stupidest moments, right? And vice versa, right? If I see J.D. Vance in my feed, it's definitely some moment where he's doing something stupid. Yes. But in both cases, it's obviously very selective, isn't it? But that's what the algorithm gives us, because you don't have to question your own ideas, right? You just look at it and think, "Well, that
doesn't make you stop and think." I mean, part of why I like trying to engage with more conservative media is, you know, first of all, I think I have a responsibility to bring my worldview into spaces where it's not always found. Hmm, and it's just more interesting, right? Like, you learn more and think more. You think more intensely about this. Who did you visit last week? Francis Gauguin. Do you know who Frances Gauguin is? That girl who set up the social settlement, who, uh, was a whistleblower on Facebook, and they ended up having to pay about 25 billion in fines in 47 states. They filed a lawsuit against Meta. Do you know what she said? That was the most interesting thing, Pete.
Mhm. She said that on Facebook they had a program called "crosscheck." And within the "crosscheck" they started a new thing that they measured: let's say you're a liberal. And they wanted to see: why are so many people on the conservative side liking your posts? Mhm. Or you're a conservative: why do so many left-wing people still love this guy? Mhm. And then they ranked these people. Even as you sit here now, most people on your side don't do this. Like, they're not going to come and sit here. Mhm. But they'll look at this and say, " At least this guy is willing to talk." They extend the algorithm. She said Facebook started doing this for
people who had a high sanity score, that they could sit down and talk to the person on the other side. So, it's funny that you say that. You mean they rate us as users based on how sensible we are? Like, how open to you are, because you're sitting here with me. Oh, how is the speaker? So, they'll say: let's say your post got 20,000 likes on Instagram. I'm just making it up. But 2,800 were conservatives. Why did 2,800 people like Pete? Who is this guy? Oh, it's Pete Buttigieg. Interesting. Whatever he
says, he forces people on the opposite side to also agree with him on certain issues. Let's expand its audience. It's just that they started, you know, it was when she was talking about it. I thought that was fascinating. Handmade in Portugal, where craftsmanship is a way of life for those who move through life differently. From sun-drenched terraces to casual evenings, every detail is thought out, every step is effortless. Made from fine suede and built with technology designed to move with you. Because true luxury is not about being noticed. It's about how you feel when you arrive.
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