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Kidmaxing. Ultimate state status symbol. Kidsmaxing. I mean, we've heard about It looks bad. Looksmaxing, all this stuff, but kidsmaxing. And this is a New York Times story. It's not like it's a Yeah. It's a New York Times story. So, let me get to it. What is this kidsmaxing stuff? And birth rates are falling across much of the developed world, but some ultra-wealthy men are pursuing fatherhood on an unprecedented scale. Using surrogacy, sperm donation, IVF, and other product reproductive technologies, they are creating dozens or even hundreds of children, highlighting what is described as inequality made flesh at a time when many ordinary families feel
they cannot afford even one child. Examples include Stefan Soloviev, who has 22 children, Pavel Durov, who is a Telegram guy, who says his sperm donations have produced more than 100 children, Greg Lindberg, who reportedly expanded his family to at least 12 children through what he called a baby project and claims that some wealthy Chinese businessmen have eight have sought to father hundreds of children through US surrogacy agencies. Elon Musk, who has 14 known children, reportedly who wants to use a surrogate to reach a legion level and joked that Durov's total represented rookie numbers, laugh my ass off Genghis Khan. Many of these men appear to view spreading their DNA
as a public good. Musk has said smart or even rich people should have more children. Durov called the sperm high-quality donor material. Jeffrey Epstein reportedly admired a sperm bank associated with Nobel winners. The common thread is a belief that their bloodlines deserve to be multiplied. Modern reproductive technology allows these ambitions to expand far beyond historical limits. IVF and surrogacy make it possible to create many pregnancies simultaneously while selecting traits such as sex or screening embryos for disease. One egg donor said Lindberg wanted 12 blood blond-haired, blue-eyed boys, while Epstein's email reflected a similar fixation on blue eyes. Musk has reportedly used polygenic [clears throat] embryo screening. Tom, what do you
think about the story? So, I wonder if the New York Times understands that kid maxing involves not having abortions. It seems like the You are so funny. It seems like You're a comic, Tom. No, no, no. I'm just wondering if the New York Times I'm actually with Tom on that, Jerry. I'm wondering I wonder if they realize I wonder if the editorial board realizes what this story actually meant. Um so, you know what? Uh this has been going on for a while. I mean, you go back The reason I bring up Genghis Khan is
because there were these leaders in history that wanted to have many kids and they wanted their heritage to be spread. And so, you know, do I think that there's people out there doing this? Yeah, I do. You know, I think it's kind of messed up. I think if you're going to have kids, make them yours. You and your wife, raise them, you know, build great citizens out of them, build great people out of them. Uh that's what I think. You know, I've just just creating a larger mob in the name of yourself and, you know, we saw the flaw in the Epstein where he wrote about that. We saw that terrible, terrible flaw where you're just out there trying to you know, spread your progeny everywhere. And so,
you know, I see the impulse to it, but if you want to have a big family, make it yours. Raise them your Adam. This is an interesting conversation. Uh obviously, Elon Musk is leading the league on kid maxing. Um but it's just evidence that as a man, you know, they say the rich get richer. You're familiar with the K-shaped economy, you know, the top is doing well and the bottom is doing poorly. This is just evidence that if you're a man and you kind of get your stuff together, you have options. Now, I'm not condoning
something like this, but I understand that there's a lot of guys that do. I'll actually tell you a funny story about that. But the top 10% of men, whether it becomes looks-maxing or money-maxing or status-maxing, you have options. And what are the options that you have? Where to live, what to do, what women, and what you want to do with your children. So, juxtapose that with the bottom 50% of men are just trying to get a girlfriend. Much less married, much less kid-maxing out here and having multiple kids from multiple moms. I'll tell you a quick story. I don't think it's a secret, uh that Andrew Tate and Tristan Tate and some of their friends, we were talking
about this one time, and they were like, "Listen, I have this thing and I have this thing and all these different women and these different kids." And I said, "I hear you guys." And they're kind of advocating, "This is maybe something you're interested in doing." I go, "Guys, it sounds really complicated. Like, how are you dealing with time zones, baby mama drama, baby drama?" They're like, "Listen, you got to be built for this." I go, "Guys, respectfully, I don't think I'm built for this. I'm just trying to do one right now." So, I understand that really, really rich guys maybe want to do something like this, but uh I just want to give PBD a shout-out. Four kids,
leader. Uh I think most men understand that, you know, have a family, have kids, raise them, be with them together, and that's probably the best approach. But again, I'm not going to hate on the guys that What do you want to have the benefits of success. Let me ask you a question. If all of a sudden I sat down with you guys and I said, "Vinny, let's just say Tom, we're having a conversation the three of us and the four of us." And I said, "Guys, I want to go out there and go to a sperm bank and donate a hundred because I want to have a hundred baby David kids out there. What would you tell me? Just have a conversation as if we're friends. What would you tell me? Vinny, here's what I want to do.
It's going to cost me surrogacy, it's a hundred thousand dollars a pop. I get to pick the mom to make sure they're healthy. And I'm going to do a hundred kids. That's what I want to do. Mhm. It's going to cost me $10 million, but I want to make that investment. What do you guys think about it? I would just ask you why you want to do something like that. Why? Because the birth rate is low and I want to be able to I'm Again, I'm No, no, you're you're just role-playing. Of course, of course.
I The birth rate is low. I can afford it. I'd like to contribute to society and this is one way of me doing it. taking care of these 100 kids? Um I would be willing to give a certain amount of money to them, but up front $100,000 to the mother who chooses to have this baby. Now, then what is the benefit of you doing this? I know you want to contribute to the birth rate, but 100 kids is not going to change the birth rate that much.
The argument would be, you know, the access to a good DNA, strong genes that these kids could go out there and be a net positive to society. I'm just role-playing and then I'll I'll let you take over. Is this more about your legacy and like and the world being shaped by you or do you actually want to be a father for all these kids? Which one is it? Uh little bit of both, but the bigger part is the 1.58 1.58 birth rate. Yeah, but you're not really moving the needle with 100 kids.
I think I'm I'm helping it. I'm helping someone else. your part. Well, but here's my thing. From a Christian perspective, which I know that you are, I think you know this, children are a blessing. It's not a trophy. God doesn't care if you have one or if you have 10, but I think God cares about how you raise them and being a father isn't just making babies. It's raising them, okay? And a woman man and a woman who love God and have character and make the world better. If you're just putting them out there, Pat, that's 100 moms that have this kid, no father, no They're not watching the social media, the pornography, the school, the trans, the I get to see you. My father was there, but he wasn't there. I get to
see how Tom raises his daughters. I get to see every single day how you do it with all the with the girls and the boys and I see it and I don't even know how you do it. The work that you guys put into these children to make them amazing human beings and I'm seeing for the past 4 years, I'm seeing it, Pat. And I don't think it's possible to do that with all these kids. God forbid. Pat, what if they all turn into some America-hating socialist, you know, what is the um Adam with the Sharia law-loving Oh, okay. everybody hating America. Like the odds of them, Pat, turning into the kids that you have made up to this point, I think
are slim to none. The goal isn't to have the most kids. I think it's the raise adults you say to me? who stand on their own. Well, I would say this. I would say, Pat, you know what? You can have those surrogates, 100,000 each, deliver a baby. How do you deliver a great person into that society at 18 years old to live, work, and be what you want? Because you're not I know you, Pat. You're not just thinking about the birth rate. You're thinking about the quality of those people and what they believe in and what they do. How do you deliver that? You can deliver the baby. Why not
just Why don't just adopt a hundred today Oh, there you go. them? Yeah, but it's the DNA. It's the DNA, the wire. So the audience argument to that would be the DNA, the wiring, the genetics, the bloodline. You're coming from that bloodline, and that's that's man wants to procreate. That's what man wants to do. They want to procreate. You know what would it would make me think about with this? And it Listen, we're just having this argument right now. Just a very basic conversation. Is back in the days how many time would kids see their fathers? Actually think about it.
They're at work all day. Your wife got pregnant. You're going to go out there and hunt, and then you come back. You would go to war. You would protect. You would do all this other stuff. And I'm not talking about 50 years ago. I'm talking about for a couple thousand years. That's kind of what life was like. So this whole thing about being here all the time around your kids, this is a new thing. This is a 50, 60, 80-year thing. This is not a 500-year thing. This is not even a 300-year thing that we have. But let me give it on the opposite side and argue my own point. Raising a kid is about 500 5-minute conversations, not about one or one weekend spending time with them or, you know, five weekends spending time with them. No,
it's about 500 5-minute conversations that they want to have with Daddy while they're going through different issues in their lives. And that's how you shape them. There are a lot of parents who same genetic, same mom, and that one kid comes out and say that person didn't get a lot of attention and they end up being a rebel and then they don't do anything. And then there are those that you can shape their mindset and they can do a good thing. So, it's not just DNA. This thing is hard. Like this webinar that we did last week for fathers webinar. I've never done a webinar that the show ratio was that high. It was the biggest showing we ever had on the
webinar where I talked about the 20 rules for fathers, the you know, the phase that every man needs to go through, how fathers are judged. It takes 40 years for us to be judged. Then, are your kids a net positive to society? And last but not least, do they yearn your company years after they no longer need you? Do they want I don't know. It's like, "Hey, man, Six types of fathers I thought was so powerful. Yeah. And so, you know, by the way, if you didn't get a chance to watch it, if you go to vtwebinar.com, register, they'll send a link to you.
Um I don't know. There's a part of me that likes that these guys are using their resources. If you have to choose between one of two, I want you to process this. And audience, I like to hear from you as well. You got one guy who's a billionaire who is willing to put his resources, IVF, whatever it is, and have 100-plus kids, or a guy who's a billionaire and says, "I don't want to have any kids." Which one is a net positive to society? No family. Neither one wants to get married and have kids. One guy is saying, "I'll give the money away." And hey, 100 kids, 100 girls, you guys go do your thing. The other one, "Nope, I just want to live for myself selfishly." Who's a
more net positive to society? Neither wants to get married. Neither wants the responsibility of day-to-day father. On surface On the surface it's a procreating one, but I really want to know his motivations and how he's going to ensure that those kids are not like Look at the Kennedy grandchildren. Delinquents from A to Z. There's like two, three. You go take a look at it. Yeah. If you don't get involved 500 5-minute conversations, great. Then you've got a bunch of rich kids that are delinquents that are impacting the rest of us.
I think what you're saying with raising the kids, Pat, is more is caught than taught. I know you've talked about this. PBD? Yeah. I'm Yeah. Okay, got you. I want you to react to this. You know the famous quote, "Any man can be a father, but it takes a special man to be a dad." I think that's kind of what you're saying, is it not? Yeah. Yeah, I am. But what I'm trying to say is I'm I'm wondering if you have between the two, who is going to be a bigger net positive to society.
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