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Just how heavy is the pressure of playing NHL hockey in Canada and will this country ever see a Stanley Cup again? Obviously. Fingers crossed. Ever is a long time. I'm obviously being a bit dramatic with that second part there, but there's been a very interesting trend I've been following this postseason and it ties to something that Quinn Hughes came out and said just last week. He's quoted as saying a lot of people haven't had the experiences he's had even if guys have played 800, 900 games, they haven't played in the Olympics or honestly had the pressures of what he's dealt with.
Not everyone's been a captain in a Canadian market at a young age. He said he was at 500 games, but he kind of feels like he's got the same amount of experience under his belt as guys with nine or a thousand games and what we're seeing this playoffs, we've seen it with Quinn Hughes and we're seeing it with Mitch Marner. Two guys who were stuck in Canadian markets for a long time now blossoming in their first season outside of Canada. Hughes is two points shy of his single season playoff high in seven less games. He's already doubled any playoff goal total he's ever had with four goals. Marner, same story. He's got six goals already. The most he ever had before this postseason was three and he's already passed his playoff single season
total. So, I'll start with you Josh with this question. Is there any merit at all to these comments from Hughes and do you think stars and teams in general in Canada are just destined to fail with everything that's thrown at them? Look Levi, I'm going to turn 32 years old this year and I've never seen a Canadian team win the Stanley Cup. So, you do the math, right? I mean, maybe we're just cursed, but no, I think it really just varies by player and in the case of Quinn Hughes, he was always good in those two playoff runs he had with Vancouver. The team around him was like more of the issue, I think. So, I think certain players are built to handle the pressure of being in a Canadian market. I think Hughes was, but
you know, now he's out. He's on a way better team. He's flourishing. But you know, we see guys like Marner, that's a little different, too. He was for his hometown team, center of the hockey universe, that's some extra pressure. Clearly, that pressure got to him and you know, he I think really read some of the like hate and stuff and that bothered him. He let that get to him, whereas a guy like Nylander in Toronto is just such a different guy. Like he doesn't really care what people think or what people say. So, I really think it just boils down to the person you are and the player, but you know, it's it's obviously added pressure. Yes.
Certainly other factors that you have to deal with, right? Of course, yeah. There are certain things you're going to deal with in Quinn Hughes's case in Vancouver versus being in Minnesota and being the captain in one place and not being the captain in another. Like those are some legit factors that you're going to have to deal with. I think the question then comes back to like is it something that completely takes a team in Canada out of like contention for some things or like is it too much to overcome? And that's kind of more the discussion cuz certainly in terms of like the merits of what Quinn Hughes said here, 100% true.
Like the experiences of being a captain, being a young captain in Canada to of going to the Olympics are things that guys who have played 1,500 career games have not dealt with. Like there's different things in terms of experiences that we can talk about. Like players that have had the privilege of being a captain in a Canadian market, you're not going to get that kind of experience anywhere else in all of hockey. So, I think the merits of what Quinn Hughes said certainly are true, but I think that makes you a better player, more geared to excelling in these pressure moments rather than being something that should take away from once you get to those points.
Interesting. So, so it's kind of like yes, obviously these guys are thriving now because everything's kind of been lifted off of them. They get to go out there and play freely. I mean, we're seeing the results. They're both having much better playoffs than they have in the past. Think for example, right? Like Quinn Hughes and all these NHL players really except for like a handful had never been to the Olympics and never dealt with that pressure. I there's no way that dealing with the pressure of Vancouver day in day out as a captain there does not in some way make it easier dealing with then being in the pressure of an Olympic situation. Sure, it's different pressures, but It prepares you for the Olympics.
is still dealing with pressure, so. Yeah, yeah, very well. Well, put. Well, to kind of counter this argument, I think the most interesting part is there's there's kind of two of them more so one. What we've seen with the Montreal Canadiens so far this season, it just feels like it's been a joy ride in Montreal. There's no pressure on those Obviously, there is some, but the way that they've kind of handled it and the fans and the media there feels a whole lot different than when we're sitting here bashing Mitch Marner for the eighth straight postseason here in Toronto. Um similarly is what we kind of saw the Oilers do. Obviously, they didn't win and I think Connor McDavid
probably has the most pressure on him of anybody ever in hockey right now. And he's kind of like we're seeing that he only signed the two-year or the extension. He's regardless of it's a Canadian market or not, he's kind of eager to get out is the sense that I think a large majority of hockey fans are getting. So, I'll ask you, John, how does this narrative kind of resonate with those two instances? With the Canadiens and the Oilers, do you think that there's pressure on those teams still? Are they managing it better? Those have been the two teams that honestly feel like they're going to give us the best chance at breaking this Cup curse as well. So, where do you sit with that? I mean, I think a lot of this just
comes down to ownership and management like Okay. The thing is I feel like you need to really own being a Canadian franchise when you're Canadian franchise. Like you need to lean into this franchise. You need to, you know, point out the weaknesses in terms of like that's just something we're not going to be able to do. You know, the taxes are higher here usually. The winter weather, you know, the fan and media pressure. But then on the flip side, you know, we're seeing it in real time with Montreal. Who doesn't want to play in the Bell Centre right now as the home team? And they've really that fan base has gotten behind this team in like such a an
extreme way where, you know, and part of it is cuz the players are likable. I mean, Dobish he's fired up. He's And they're winning. And they're Of course, the winning cures all. And you know, Suzuki's likable and Caufield and you go up and down the list. And I just feel like, you know, say if you're a Canadian, you know, Canadian owner A, I think you need to lean into the fact that there's so much passion around the team and there's endorsements to be had and there's some real benefits in terms of the amount of resources you can have as a team. Like the Leafs and the Canadians make way more money than any other team. I guess the Canucks are probably in there and Rangers or whatever, but the top of the
earners list across the league Most valuable franchises. Yeah, like yeah, exactly. Revenue High revenue teams. They have an advantage off the ice where they can just go hire this person and that person, have a better gym and it like you need to show that to your free agent prospective free agents. You need to show that to your core guys and go, "Listen, you're not going to get this elsewhere or not to this degree." So, that's part of it, too. And I just feel like there are there's been some moments over the last 30 years or some periods, I should say, where the wrong owner's been in these Canadian cities. You think of Eugene Melnyk in Ottawa. What a tumultuous time that was. And he hires a guy like Pierre
Dorion who shouldn't have been the face of the franchise. And then you look at Montreal. Jeff Molson and Kent Hughes. You look at, you know, that tandem. A lot more, shall we say, professional, a lot more sort of like um I guess uh adept at dealing with, you know, the pressures of the market and, you know, maybe talking to reporters off the record so that it becomes, you know, more of a um better relationship from that perspective. So, I just think that there is ways to spin this in your favor if you're a Canadian market. And I feel like if you think about ownership, a lot of these people who end up in the owner's suite, they built the product or a service that really depends on the public perception, right? It's like I don't say you whatever.
You make pens and you're trying to sell pens. You're you're the whatever. this pen. Yeah, exactly. You care about what your customers think day-to-day. You're trying to move product. In hockey, like it's more of a long-term play and you can't be reacting in the moment every, you know, day or week or month and switching focus or doing things just because hey, this part of the fan base is pissed off or this, you know, high-profile media members really all over us. I think that's what happens in Vancouver a lot. I think that the ownership there, it's a lot about perception versus like what should be
the main focus is like what's our long-term vision and how do we execute it? Yeah. Yeah, it's great point. I mean, we've seen it too in Toronto where I don't know if that Mitch Marner situation last year, everything aside, you know, I feel like a hockey team with their head on their shoulders, Mitch Marner gets traded for something. He doesn't they don't let him walk because fans want to see one more run out of him in the playoffs and see what this team can do. Um and that's I want to focus on him a little bit before we get out of here because our good friend Kyle here is obviously a big-time Leafs fan and just to kind of circle everything back to this pressure and what it's like playing
in Toronto, uh this exchange I found on Twitter was perfect where uh JD Bunkis show on Sportsnet, he says that if Marner does what he's doing right now for Vegas in Toronto, there would be a statue waiting for him on Legends Row. And he talked about how this how this affected his legacy in Toronto, but that those are real words that were said. And the quote tweet here is uh William Nylander through nine games last playoffs actually had two more points than Marner had through nine games this playoff. So, obviously, the different in perception the difference in perception when a guy gets out of town versus when he's doing it for you. The fans just don't respect playoff hockey and success as well cuz they don't come with the wins, which
obviously Mitch Marner's getting now in Vegas. So, Kyle, as a Leafs guy, what do you think of what Marner's doing right now and how pissed off are you? Those are the two big questions I have for you. Well, it's nightmare fuel, really. Like you think about all of like the game five through seven stats that we saw forever in Toronto and especially at the end of last year, the end of the tenure, and then he goes to Vegas and then in his first game six, he has the two goals and an assist. They win the series, they move on, and early on in the series against Anaheim, he has a hat trick and follows it up with like a four-point game or whatever it was, or three assists.
Like crazy. like that. And it's a situation where yes, there's nuance to it. Was he playing the Utah Mammoth or the Anaheim Ducks defense in rounds one or two when he got there in Toronto? No. Yeah. And that's something that you have to factor in. But also, you have to factor in the fact that he's not dealing with all the stuff around Toronto. And that's where it kind of comes back to our original discussion of the Canadian pressure and the pressure of Canada. And Josh, I think you mentioned it earlier where like he's a guy that clearly let some of it get to him. And whether that's Mitch Marner letting it get to him or the people around him allowing it to get to him, I think is a different
conversation. But certainly it's a case where you see what he's doing right now and it lends some credence to the pressure of getting away from it can allow some players to flourish. And I think that's kind of like the middle area where overall I don't think it is something that the pressure can take a team completely out of contention or anything like that. But in certain circumstances, there are certain players that are going to be better suited playing elsewhere than in those certain markets. I one thing for Mitch Marner specifically I go back to is like it wasn't always the case with this fan base and Mitch Like you think about those early couple of playoffs and like I think about like his late game
shot block in whatever game it was against the Bruins early in that series. Like, that felt like it was the huge moment that things were going to take off from, and obviously it went the opposite direction ultimately, but when it comes to like our conversation about the Habs or whatever Canadian team, when they're winning or when it's early in a cycle, I think it is such a huge bonus of having that fan base behind you and the pressure is there to succeed, of course, but to be a good team in Canada is a great thing. I think where we see some of the downsides to it, either with Toronto and what the vitriol has become or even maybe a little bit with Edmonton, but less so, I think, is once it gets a little bit
stale or once it's been a handful of kicks at the can. Um once it gets to that point in the cycle gets a little restless after losing has gone on for so long. It's Yeah, like as you were saying, the Habs fans are so patient right now, but give them, you know, five straight early round exits and then playoff run, right? This is the second playoff run for them. If it gets to year four or year five and you have first round exits or you have disappointments, that's when it starts to turn a little bit. So, I think that's like the balancing act of it, right? Where I think early on in Toronto, like that first playoff series against Washington, where the pressure was completely off because it was a young
team and then the pressure starts to mount year over year. I think that's like a god, as you would say. as he said. But, like you talk about like the statue and stuff, like the guys on a lot of the guys on Legends Row or the guys that are revered in Toronto didn't win as well. Yeah. Like, you think about how long it's been for the Leafs. We talk about the drought for Canada. Talk about the drought for the Leafs. Oh, yeah. The guys that just went on runs, like Gilmour and Clark and Sundin and all these guys, they didn't win Stanley Cups. They made conference finals. They didn't even make Stanley Cup finals, and they're revered in the city. So, when you talk about
Mitch Marner and what he's doing now, I don't think it's that hyperbolic to go out and say like if he had that kind of performance and the Leafs went to a conference final. We'll see what ends up happening ultimately with the Golden Knights here because they could easily go and go out in the second round like the Leafs did a couple of times. Um I think that's where the conversation shifts potentially, but certainly as the Leafs fan looking at what Mitch Marner is doing and seeing him probably at top the charts of cons, my thoughts at this point is nightmare fuel. I like the point about all these Leaf legends didn't win. Maybe as Toronto as a city and as the fans here, that's what we need to start appreciating. Let's
just start appreciating guys playing well in the playoffs. They don't need to win. They just need to get some points and there you go. You'll end up on Legend's Row. really isn't that high for like That's the thing. The last thing I thought about as you were going on about that, you know, like we saw the pressure clearly get to Quinn Hughes with him coming on saying that. How many straight seasons did the Minnesota Wild lose in the first round? What was that? Seven or eight? Their first playoff series win in over 15 years or something. And I hardly heard a peep. I know we're up here in Toronto. It's probably different over there in Minnesota, but could you imagine if the Leafs never broke? I
mean, the Leafs how many years in a row did they lose in the first round and it was like the sky is falling. Tampa Bay just lost in the first round for the fourth straight year. Yeah. And you these things like you don't even really recognize until you sit down, take a deeper look, but the Leafs lose twice the back-to-back first rounds or something and all of a sudden everything's, you know, going astray. So, it's a very curious conversation and I think the big picture here is really how long is it going to take until a Canadian market wins the Stanley Cup and how much is this pressure going to continue to spiral and spiral on these teams where guys get in situations early in cup runs and you know, early
in their stints there and they're like, I can't handle this anymore like we've seen with Marner, like we've seen with Hughes. Um that's the question I'm going to have for the comment section. I mean, when do you guys think the next cup comes to Canada? Let us know down below. We'll catch you guys in the next one.
