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For anyone who has heard of astrology but doesn't quite know what it is, what is astrology and how does it work Well, astrology is the study of how the sky reflects what happens on Earth. Astrology and your birth chart are a mirror of your life, your life purpose, and your soul. It is a mirror of the events that also occur on Earth. And when you are born, a person's birth chart is literally like a map of their life. It's a map of your potential, it's a map of your problems, it's a map of your areas for growth. It's a map of all the ways you need to grow, work, and transform yourself. And what it also means is that there is this feeling that you are a talisman
of the exact moment you were born. So every moment in life has its own card. For example, our meeting today has its own letter. And it is a crystallization, or the letter becomes a map of what we are crystallizing together. So, you as a person, at birth, we observe and take a snapshot of the entire sky at the exact place and time you were born. And we see where everything was in the sky, and that's your amulet. If you decide to work with it and observe it. So you observe everything, from the stars, the moon, the position of where you were born, and the time of your birth. Yes, we are watching everything. Literally right now, if we were to take a picture of the sky, because we are in this place and it is this time, there is a
specific sign rising above the horizon The sun is in a specific place in the sky, and everything else, in relation to the Earth, is in a specific place and has a certain relationship. Therefore, astrology is the study of those relationships. For anyone listening who is skeptical about astrology, who has their doubts or is cynical about it, what would you say to them? Brilliant. I love it. They should be cynical. And besides, heaven forbid we all like the same things. In other words, I don't think I really want to live in a world where everyone believes in astrology, whatever that means.
I believe diversity is very important I believe my main goal is for you to understand what your life's purpose is, to move towards it as effectively as possible, and for that to lead you to serve the world in your own unique way. I think for me, astrology is my quickest entry point to that, but there are a thousand ways, and they are all legitimate and wonderful. I just want you to find yours. So, if you don't like astrology, great. I do n't know anyone, and I know, I'm sure there are people out there. I do n't know anyone who has spent a significant amount of time studying astrology, really studying it thoroughly, and then feeling that it had no merit.
Jung, the psychotherapist, psychologist, famously thought it was ridiculous, studied it, became, and then really became someone who greatly impacted the field. But I feel that most people who do n't like it are thinking about sun sign horoscopes, which are like a gateway drug to astrology. Like, they're not the important thing. Tell me about the difference between what you say. Yes. Sun sign horoscopes. Well, sun sign horoscopes were developed around the time of the printing press, so that people could have an easy access point to understand their astrology. Because basically, if you knew the day you
were born, more or less, you knew what your sun sign was. But, before that, I was very, very focused on the rising sign. And the ascendant is so specific because, again, it's about where you're born and the exact time, because that's the exact part of the sky that's rising above the eastern horizon. And that's your life marker. It's like your "yes, here I am". I am saying yes to this life. I am, you know, independent of the body that brought me here, all that. So, your sun sign is something you share with people who were born within 30 days of you. It's very general. There's a lot to learn from it, but it's not your birth chart. Only your ascendant can tell us your entry point and then configure the entire chart. It establishes the
meaning of everything else for you. So, it's like looking at a small part of an image or even a single pixel instead of looking at the whole thing. Mhm. So, yes, if you're thinking, "I don't want to be reduced to a couple of clichés about my sun sign," I agree with you. Me neither. That's why I don't even like to talk about my birth chart in public, because I don't like people thinking they understand me with something so superficial. And your letter is much more complex than that. I mean, there are like fractals of
fractals that you can delve into, with meanings that people have dedicated years and years of their lives to. So your sun sign is fun to share. It's very easy to turn it into a meme. It's very easy to turn into a game. It's very easy to share. Therefore, it is an entry point, but it has very little to do with the reality of what we see when we look at your chart. Yes, that's a relief. Yes. That's good. Yes, it's very useful because I feel you're absolutely right: it can be shared, it's interesting, it's fun to talk about, but when you see how valuable or accurate it is, you'll naturally never feel that way.
Yes. It's just like a general personality test that divides you into four basic personality types. It's as if, obviously, we were much more complex and profound than that. And we all believe it, especially as we get older. Can you explain, since you've been mentioning the birth chart and the chart? Can you explain what a birth chart is? I imagine it's when you're born, as you said, where everything is in the sky, but can you explain how someone can read that chart? What does it mean to read someone's birth chart? Yes, it's a snapshot of the sky at the exact moment you were born, from the precise place and time of your birth. And everything in it is related to everything else. Therefore, you are actually describing all the relationships that make up your life.
And it's, you know, you can see it through the lens of your personality, which is one thing. I think it can be quite reductionist when we do that. But ancient or traditional astrology is more about observing the quality of each area of your life. For example, where can someone expect to succeed? Where can someone expect to encounter difficulties? What are the things that are working for them? And what are the things that will be a challenge and, therefore, a point of growth and an opportunity to develop? So you can deduce someone's nature from this, but it's really about, you know, if someone is having difficulty finding love in their life and you look at their letter, you see, like, ah yeah, I can understand why it's a struggle. It does
n't mean they'll be fighting forever. This means that the letter will distinguish what the problem is, and therefore, once we know what the problem is, we can work more clearly or definitively towards solving it. So it can be a great help in terms of what pain you're carrying? Like, what are the things you 're carrying in this life? Your letter will reveal that. And that can also be a real comfort, because sometimes it can feel as if we have something working against us in life. Like, why is n't this working for me, or why does it never take shape for me? And when you can see it on the chart, you can say, "Ah, okay.
It's just one configuration, but there are other ways to work with it. But first I need to know what the problem is." So, I think astrology helps us identify if you have someone, you know, an expert looking at your chart or if you have, you know, a good education about what it really is, then we can use the chart to really open those doors for us Because without knowing what the problem is, it's very difficult to try to deal with it. You can do it through therapy, you can do it through many different ways. Again, astrology is one of them. How much of this is really that important? You just said that the intern must be an expert.
Yes. And I almost think the receiver needs to be an expert too. Yes. And what I mean by that is that I've always seen. So, I never studied this, but as part of my teachings at the monastery, we had people practicing Vedic astrology, which is thousands and thousands of years old. People had incredible experiences using them. There are places in India where they use leaves and there are writings on leaves, there are letters with literally strings tied to them. I mean, the culture and history behind it is spectacular. But what I discovered was that, for example, if I know it's going to rain tomorrow and there's a competent weather forecast, which, by the way, I don't know who makes good weather forecasts
anyway. But let's say it's going to rain tomorrow. As a competent person looking at that forecast, I know that tomorrow I'd better take my umbrella. My boots that I don't mind getting wet in the rain and a raincoat. And therefore, it requires me to adapt to the information. Mhm. Whereas what I have often found nowadays is that when people feel they are going through a rough patch or something isn't working out for them. It's like saying, "Well, I can't do anything right now because I'm going through a
rough patch." And that's like me saying, "Well, I can't have fun tomorrow because it's going to rain." Yes. So tell me about it. And if I'm wrong, feel free to correct me. I'm just sharing what I've heard and seen. Yes. Yes, it's the human problem. It's the human condition, I think, to try to reduce things to something simple enough to blame life or try to solve it very quickly. And we also try, I think, to have a single answer for everything. So, you know, I mean, I understand why it's so annoying because everyone's like, "Oh, Mercury retrograde." And you say, "No, it's not good for that." I mean, yes, but I'll ask you about that in a moment.
That's not it, you can't do that. I mean, you ca n't blame everything, or I hear people saying, "Well, you know, I'm a Scorpio." And I say, "That has nothing to do with being a Scorpio." I mean, I understand the desire to do that, but that's not it; you're using a hammer for everything, and sometimes you need a pen And, in other words, you need different tools. So, yes, it is an interesting thing because when we enter a period of time that seems very complex astrologically, you want to approach it as: "Okay, it looks like it's going to challenge us. It looks like it's going to require a lot of attention from us, it looks like it's going to require a lot of tenacity, and it looks like it's going to
require more from us in general Brilliant. So, now we know. Then, appear. How can I help people show up in that moment without reducing it to the idea that everything is going to be terrible or that this is the reason why it's happening? Because if we lived in a world where compassion, consideration, community, and the health and well-being of people were paramount, bad astrology wouldn't be so bad. It is not astrology that makes things worse. It is revealing or gives you a kind of understanding, again, of certain cycles and times of things. And if we can see, well, what happened the last time this cycle occurred and what worked, then we can use it as something that empowers us. If astrology isn't empowering, I don't
think you should use it. Mhm. If you feel that astrology reduces you to something, scares you, or makes you paranoid, I do n't think it's working. I think you should stop taking it and never take it again. Mhm. Until that happens, or maybe for the rest of your life. It should help you feel more grounded and better prepared. Like, I love the rain. So if it's going to rain tomorrow, great. Maybe I can have, you know, a melancholy day where I drink tea and write in my diary. That's my fantasy. I have a son, so I ca n't do that. I love that now. I remember days like that.
I love that now. So, what's the difference between your sun, your moon, and your ascendant? Because you hear people using this language all the time. Yes, yes, yes. What's the difference? What does it mean? Yes. Well, your rising sign is the marker of your life. It's the marker of your yes to life. So it's the marker of your motivation. It's what motivates you to do things here in the world. And it's your yes. It's like, okay, I'm here. I was born. Your sun is how you shine. It's like part of how you illuminate, how your soul illuminates things. It's like what ignites you. And your moon is your body. Your moon is the
physical world. If you think of the moon as a reflector of sunlight, the moon in our chart reflects the light of our soul, the light of our sun. And we can only have this incarnation through the body. And so, she is the possessor, the guardian of memory. It has to do with the physical world and the physical realm and the sacredness of having a body in which to have incarnated. And we manage to fulfill our life's purpose through the body a little bit each day. Whether it's tiredness, joy, or everything in between, the body keeps track of all of it, so to speak. So, when you read someone's birth chart, you're seeing all of this.
Could you give examples of what would fit in each case for someone you've read before? Randomly, obviously, you know. Yes, yes. Well, for example, when someone has Leo on their ascendant, they have the motivation to really show up and shine in the world. They are motivated by illuminating something, being charming, being adorable, being recipients of people's adoration or attention But what the rising sign also does is give you a key to the meaning of your life, because the planet
that rules that sign is the one that guides the ship of your life. So, if you feel lost, if you're unsure of your purpose, one of the quickest ways to understand it astrologically is to see where the planet that rules your ascendant is located. Therefore, if the ruler of your ascendant is in your 10th career house, that will be an important part. If it's in your 6th house of service, maybe your volunteering is, you know, it's like, where are the planets located and what work are they doing? The planet that rules your ascendant is literally in command of the ship of your life. And often, when I give readings to people, and over the years I have given readings mostly to strangers And you know, before Zoom, before the pandemic, when we were all on
Skype, I didn't even see people. I mean, I guess we could use cameras, but mostly it was like I was on the phone with people all over the world. So I didn't know them, I'd never seen them, I don't know anything about you. I'm just going to read your letter. It started there, and 99% of the time people were very relieved to hear that was what it was. Because they often hadn't fully experienced it, or it was so innate that they always did that, and said, "Oh, yes, that's it." "That's why I've always been known for." And so, when you don't live in accordance with these, like these signs for me in your letter, if you don't live in accordance with your purpose, then everything will feel wrong and everything will feel misaligned.
For example, I never thought I would write a book. It's not something I would have ever thought of, but nothing in my life was working. And I felt so stuck, and I felt. I felt like a failure. I felt like I could n't find my place in the world. And I started writing, and people started reading it, and it started taking off, and I was like, "What is this? This is crazy." And it wasn't until I started working with my teacher, the person who would really teach me about the lineage I practice, that I understood how important it was to follow that mark in my chart, because the ruler of my ascendant is in the third house of writing, speaking, and teaching. But that's something I hadn't made the connection with before. As you can see your
, you know, your own chart. You look in the mirror, you can read your.you can look at yourself all the time and not understand it. The beauty of having a therapist, a guide, a coach, or an astrologer-someone with some wisdom-is that they maintain that third space for you, so you can have that kind of self-reflection. So, coming to know that natural inclination in me was there in my letter, gave me permission to just do it completely. Yes. And then everything started to work. Overnight, people started sharing my things. I met my wife in 6 months. I mean, things just blew up. And that was the reason. I remember the moment when
she said, "Well, the ruler of your ascendant is in the third house." And I said, "Oh," and it all clicked. And I had always wanted to write, but I never thought I was smart enough. I didn't think I had enough education. I didn't think I was capable of doing it. And it is literally one of the things that changed my whole life. And it's right there, clear as the day in my letter, and I didn't see it for about 20 years. Wow. Because I started looking at astrology and understanding my chart when I was about 12 years old. Wow. But, really no, I really didn't know what I was looking for because I didn't have traditional astrology. So, you know, when you meet your
teacher, everything really starts to come into practice and take shape. And then, when I met my astrology teacher and she taught me this ancient, traditional way of doing astrology, everything made sense. It was like a complete rubric, so clear, concise, and specific, that it didn't depend on my intuition or what I felt about the birth chart or anything like that. It was n't about, oh, I once knew a Scorpio and they did this. It's more like, no, if this is here, it means this. Yes. Do this and see what happens. So, you're actually saying that astrology guides us. When you say purpose, Mhm. You're actually talking about activity, task, methodology. As you said, writing, speaking, teaching.
Yes. I have many friends who tell me this, and they're not speaking astrologically, they're just speaking from self-awareness. Yes. They tell me: Jay, that's just how I am. They tell me: Jay, you are ambitious, you are determined. Yes. You know, I'm not. Yes. And well, you know, this is just my life. And I say: well, I don't know if I was always ambitious or determined. I feel like there were things I learned and habits I developed, and there were coaches and mentors in my life who
taught me certain things, and you can develop confidence and skills that allow you to live a better life. And I'm not just referring to material things, I'm also referring to spiritual things. Yes. And they say, "No, no, no, but you know, some of us are made like you and others are n't." So, is that true? Is that. I mean, I think there's some truth to it. Okay, so yes. But I think you can choose not to stay there, right? It's like, what do you want from this life? That's really what it's about. Are those people happy? Or are they suffering? TRUE. But are they interested enough in their suffering to
do something to change it? So, what I'm looking for are periods of time that will come and put pressure on you, saying, "This, you're going to." If you haven't done your work, if you haven't individuated, if you haven't really tried to build something within yourself through your own efforts, then this period of time is going to be really difficult. But that's good for you. You know, Saturn comes as the planet of limits and structure, and it stops you until you figure out how to find another way to move or how to lift the weight you're carrying, as many times as necessary until you're strong enough to move it completely.
And Saturn is a planet that you can also observe in terms of your life cycle. So, Saturn appears every 7 years and does something very important. At age 7, it appears and helps you to distinguish yourself a little from your parents. It helps you find, so to speak, what's right for you. And then, at age 14, age 14 is often called the opposition of Saturn, and it is usually a time when something happens in our lives. And you know, we're 14 years old, so it makes sense psychologically speaking, but something happens where you say, "Wait a minute, this is what I want, this is what you want, these are the expectations you have of me, this is what." And then at 21, we have another one, and it's part of the adult cycle.
And then, from 28 to 30, Saturn closes the cycle and we go through something called a Saturn return. And that's where we cross our first really big threshold, where we move on from any remnants of being a child or young adult that should fade away, and we are asked to move forward and cross a threshold into our true adulthood and take responsibility for our decisions and actions. And if you miss it, if you say: "No". It will get increasingly difficult, and you will have another struggle in the next 7 years And that's why the saying about the seven-year crisis is interesting, because it's like a Saturn cycle. Yes. And even in marriage, right? Since most divorces occur between 5 and 7 years.
Oh. Yes. Yes, it's that point of friction. Mhm. Fascinating. Alright. Well, you write in your book that our birth chart is not our destiny. It's an invitation, and I think this idea of destiny and free will, you mentioned it earlier, but what does astrology say about destiny and free will? Do we have the capacity to act, or is everything predetermined? You and I are in this city right now. We're not in another city, we 're not in France, we're here. And therefore, there are certain conditions here. We can't do everything here. But we can do everything we can do in this city. And it's the same with your birth chart. It's like being given a landscape, what do you want to do with it?
How do you want to approach it? Yes. And how do you want to work with these very specific skills in this very specific setting? Yes, it's almost as if I was born in London. Yes. You were born in Canada. Yes. And that created a certain environment of what was available, of what I was aware of, yes, of what was possible. Yes. But somehow I ended up in Los Angeles, you lived in Los Angeles and now you live in New York. Yes. And if someone had told me until I was 28, which is when I moved to New York, if someone had ever told me, " Better come back."
Yes. If someone had told me at that age that I would live anywhere other than northwest London, I wouldn't have believed it. Wow. Oh, so you left London at 28? Yes, the first time I left was when I lived in India for a while as a monk. And then I left when I came to live in New York first and now in Los Angeles. And the reason I bring this up is to say that there are more options, Mhm. more free will and capacity for action than we sometimes think when we look at astrology and may consider that everything is predetermined Yes, yes. As I know, you know, I will see heartbreaking transitions appear for me
And I have to tell myself that I'm not going to catastrophize this. But I have to fight against it. You know, it's just a natural human thing And then I'll live it and say, "Oh, it was totally different from what I thought, but it's so emblematic of what it was." And I definitely needed to go through that. It's always about taking enough distance from the thing, from your birth chart, from what you're experiencing, so that you can understand what life is trying to teach you. So when people come to see me and they're really in trouble or in a lot of pain, sometimes it helps to tell them, " Yes, this started 6 months ago and it's going to last about 8 more months." You're in the middle of it. You know what it is. That's all.
In what other way? How do you want to cope with this? How do you want to work with this? What is this teaching you? It may be suffering, but what else is there to teach you here? Or what is it that it has come to teach you? What can you learn? And if I'm going through difficulties and I see that I'm in a challenging aspect, I can say, "Oh, that's okay." So it's not simply.it doesn't feel random, I think, to some people. And that's the other side of: "Mercury is retrograde and nothing is going to go right." We don't want to do that. But we do want to use it and say, " Okay, it's just a period of time. It's just a cycle we're in, that I'm in."
How do you feel about having helped so many people, being so involved in this work? Mhm. How have you seen astrology actually help people? How has it truly changed people's lives I believe it truly changes people's lives when they need confirmation that their soul's purpose is what they believe it to be. I remember that when I met my wife, I refused to look at her birth chart. I didn't want to see her. I didn't want to know. So I sent her to my teacher. She had a reading and my teacher knew nothing about it. She looked at her letter and said, "Oh, your life's work is in the field of gender violence." And she said, "Yes." But she was a banker at the time. And he wasn't valuing that part of his
work, even though it was something he had been doing since he was 16. And that reading gave her the kind of affirmation she needed to fully move forward with it. And it's a simple thing. You know, it's something someone tells you. And very often, at those turning points in our lives, we just need that one thing, that one person to hold that little space to tell us, "Yes, you are." "There it is." It's as clear as day. And then you can.then, again, you have to leave and do all the work. Astrology isn't going to do the work for you. Yes, you have to act according to that idea. Yes, it is. But that idea can be very reassuring and affirming, totally, because.
Yes, everyone else has been reminding you of the opposite since you were born. TRUE. We have many obligations. We have many responsibilities. Many people want us to be a certain way, not because they are bad, but simply because of the conditions we are in. And astrology is a tool that can help you stand out. And to really see you with much more clarity. And when you do, I think if you're aware, then you can act. Mhm. Until we become aware of something, we don't really have much of a choice Mhm. But once something enters our consciousness, then we have options.
What am I going to do with this information? How am I going to act? Is this something I should do something about? And if you need that, a good astrology reading should be able to show you who you are in a very clear and specific way. Mhm. And then you can choose what you want to do with that information. Mhm. Many people are talking about the return of Saturn Yes. What is it really? It is when Saturn returns to the same place it was in when you were born. And since Saturn is the last planet visible to the naked eye in our small solar system, it was considered a great moment because every 28 years you go through
this closing of a cycle. So between the ages of 27, 28, or from 27 to 30, you go through a kind of closing of a door and a threshold experience towards a new stage of life Saturn is the planet of responsibility and adulthood. And it is also the planet of mortality. It's like: "Hey, I am the lord of time." As if to say that you don't have all the time in the world. So at 30, you should be going through some kind of crisis. Something like: "Oh, I guess I'm going to get old too ." And you should also be doing things that require all of you. Saturn is a planet of discipline and hard work. So this is the time to back up your words with actions, to be fully in the game, and again, to own your decisions and say: I chose to do this.
And it is also a planet of separation. So, in some way, form or measure, we usually separate ourselves from our family of origin. Perhaps it will be psychological, perhaps physically, perhaps we will get married, perhaps some kind of major life transition will occur at that time that distinguishes us from our family of origin. It's not that we're no longer part of it; we could even continue living at home and, well, you know, for the rest of our lives. But there's something here like: I have to build a very solid foundation in the world that is my own, that is separate from where I come from, or separate from the
convenience or comfort of people who, well, I hope you have people who love you and you feel you can lean on them. But you need to understand that you can go out and do something for yourself or that you can separate yourself in the ways you need to separate yourself psychologically, emotionally, sometimes physically, sometimes monetarily. nothing negative at all. That's really cool. Why do we talk about it in such a way? Because of the internet. Because people say, oh, my Saturn return was terrible. Yes. And then they blame everything on Saturn's return But a Saturn return should be a time of, once again, discipline,
awareness, rigor, almost like severity at times, but also of great joy. As with my Saturn return, I moved to Los Angeles. Yes. And I didn't know anyone here. I had no money. I had no contacts. I had nothing. And she was euphoric. Mhm. I really left my life. I lived in Toronto. And I left and started this whole new chapter here. And it was on my own terms and I really had to prove to myself that I could do this. And there were days when I had no one to call and there were financial difficulties and I did n't have a car and it was all a big deal, but I did it And nobody will ever be able to take that away from me.
Yes. And although I believe in community and I believe we should n't live in an individualistic culture, we have to do those things that help us understand what we're made of. Yes. They help us understand things like: put me anywhere and I'll figure it out. That's how I operate, at least. And that happens. There's a version of it that happens at 7, at 14, at 21, and then around 28, that's the big one. I identify with everything you just said.
Yes. Everything you said. It's so vivid for me. It's like 14, and I say, this is young, but I remember that 14 is the age in England when you decide what you're going to study, it's.it's quite early, I suppose. TRUE. I remember arguing with my parents about what I wanted to focus on, I won and did what I wanted. And that's when I first felt confident in who I was and in my abilities. And then, at 21 turning 22, I decided to go and live as a monk. My God. It was a great decision. And then at 28, I moved to New York and was there for 2 years going through exactly what you said when you moved to Los Angeles Yes.
It's incredible how it coincides, and at 38, so I've also been through 35. Yes. Um, yes, you plant an incredible year, but you plant a seed in the Saturn return cycle of your own identity, of your own adulthood. Yes. You say, "I'm going to claim my place here." Maybe it's difficult, maybe it's horrible, maybe I feel alone. Yes. But I'm doing it. Yes. And this is my choice. And when you get to 36, you're in that next first quarter-square and you can see what worked.
Wow. What is growing from that seed you planted around age 30? Exact. You say, "Okay, either I double down on this now or it's not a viable option." And it is, I think, a really useful growth cycle. This is so important because we almost always focus on the wrong ages. Yes. If you look at it from a material perspective, we always focus on 16 or 18 years old, becoming an adult. Like being sweet 16, turning 18 means becoming an adult. At 21, you'll definitely graduate, so it seems you're on the right track. But then it's almost as if after 21 nobody cares. And then it's like, "I'm 30, I'm 40," and it just scares you.
Yeah, and then you go into a crisis. Yes, it's less about growth, it's less about. I loved what you were saying about how from 28 to 30 that whole idea was "I focus, I choose what to focus on, discipline, determination." I mean, I identify with every single one of those things. I have to put in the effort, I have to invest in myself. So we were talking about those people earlier who perhaps have a very easy situation. If they don't do that Saturn return thing and just resort to what's easy, then at 36 it gets harder And then, again in the early 40s, it happens too. And Saturn is also this market that can feel depressive.
Until, once again, you start working towards, well, what discipline do I need to do this? But some of us really thrive with discipline. And some of us really struggle with it You know, there are signatures in the birth chart. I have some friends like that, who are just so good at having fun And it's difficult to bring them together and help them focus. Because part of her life's signature is enjoying things. And then you have to work a little against that. Yes. So if someone is about to enter their Saturn return, what would you recommend they do? Do the things that are difficult, that will require everything from you, and that will be worth it in the long run.
Like, what will be satisfying for you in 7 years? Don't think about instant gratification. No, this is not a social media game. It's about what you would do if you only had 7 years left to live. What do you want to make sure you've left here? And what would lead you more deeply to your integrity? So you can be proud of having even tried. And if it's not that serious, then it 's not really part of your Saturn return or it's not going to last very long. And often people reach that age and you start to see how their lives crack because they spent their 20s in an industry that perhaps wasn't their dream industry or that took everything from them, and they realize that it's not really their calling.
So they've been caught up in this, maybe something corporate, or they've been caught up in this other relationship, and you start to see cracks appear around 28, 29, 30 years old. So this is your chance. This is like a portal in time. I mean, any day is your opportunity, but this is a time when the pressure and severity of what does n't feel right in your life will become very acute. So if you fear your Saturn return, you are actually fearing the truth of your situation. And you're afraid to confront what you really need to do and the work it will take to do it And that's fine. You can fear it, but you can also simply embrace it, move towards it, and I think you also have to be okay with being alone, following your own path.
You have to be okay with doing something that was n't expected. You have to be okay with disappointing people. And it's a time when you're supposed to learn about limits. So, if you can't set a boundary with yourself, that is, "I will not abandon myself," then it will be very difficult. But, if you promise that you will not abandon yourself, that you will not abandon your gifts, your talents and your inner knowledge, then the return of Saturn will put you on a course that feels like a liberation. Because it strips you bare and puts you in a kind of limbo, it's this or it'll be that, what pain do you want to choose? Do you want to choose the pain of choosing what you know you should choose, or do you want to choose the pain of denying that?
And that is more or less the crossroads at which Saturn's return finds us You have completely redefined my perspective on Saturn's return. Oh excellent. It really is, and it's much more powerful too. Yes, it is. It's so powerful. so empowering. It's so clear. It's so, it's so, it's better than, it's so enlightening. Mhm. I know you've completely expanded my point of view, opened my mind in an incredible way, and answered so many questions-hopefully not stupid ones. But I have learned so much and I am truly happy for your success and your ability to
help so many people, because I can easily tell from being with you these last few hours that everything you do comes from a great place, but also that you really try to guide people towards their greatness and their best version, through all the incredible teachings, studies and research you have done So, thank you very much. thanks a lot. We end each episode of On Purpose with the last five. Yes. These questions should be answered in one word or one phrase at most. You have a sentence. Okay. Okay, so, Chani Nicholas, these are your last five. The first question is: what is the best advice you have ever heard or received?
If you choose it, don't feel sorry for yourself. Your ability to choose is your greatest gift and your greatest power. The moment you feel sorry for yourself, you disconnect. You're doing yourself the most harm possible. If you choose it, don't feel sorry for yourself for what it takes to achieve it. You can stop choosing it, but if you choose it, this is what you get. Do you still want it? What a great answer. I love that. So many questions. That was great. I love it. Second question, what is the worst advice you have ever heard or received?
Someone telling me that they didn't know how they were ever going to find love. Mhm. I do n't know if that's advice, but yes. Um, question number four, what misconception about astrology would you like to debunk? That there are certain signs that are good or bad. They 're all bad. Yes, they're all problematic. Explain. Which is the correct answer? Well, each one, each sign is an archetype. So the archetype has qualities of both magnificence and horror because they are a reflection of ourselves. So they're all problematic favorites.
Uh, fifth and final question, we ask it to all the guests who have been on the show. If you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be? I've listened to many of your episodes, but I don't remember this question. Oh, it's always the last one. Alright Fair. Because I haven't finished them. You are, you are living. Yes, exactly. That's what I'm learning, Chani. Yes. The law is that everyone's child is yours. Mhm. I love that answer. That's a great answer. I'd never heard of that before. That's brilliant.
Mhm. If this clip provided you with value and you'd like to see more, this next video has been specially chosen for you based on your viewing habits. I hope you enjoy it, and if you do, please subscribe to the channel so we can continue bringing you fantastic conversations.
